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Missile Defense

Technology has always found its greatest consumer in a nation's war and defense efforts. Since the last attempts at a "Star Wars" defense system, has technology changed considerably enough to make the latest Missile Defense initiatives more successful? Can such an application of science be successful? Is a militarized space inevitable, necessary or impossible?

Read Debates, a new Web-only feature culled from Readers' Opinions, published every Thursday.

rshow55 - 05:10pm Sep 2, 2003 EST (# 13470 of 13478)
Can we do a better job of finding truth? YES. Click "rshow55" for some things Lchic and I have done and worked for on this thread.

The growth of Human Powers Over the Past 100,000 Years http://www.mrshowalter.net/Kline_ExtFactors.htm

Each curve plots the ratio of the best technical performance at a given point in time divided by the unaided human power to accomplish the same function.

From CONCEPTUAL FOUNDATIONS FOR MULTIDISCIPINARY THINKING by Stephen Jay Kline Stanford University Press 1995, p. 173.

Please look at the curves. Our sociotechnical evolution is proceeding far faster than our biological evolution.

Looking at those curves says some basic things about what hope and hopeless look like to a sociotechnical animal.

Being part of a successful socio-technical system is hopeful. Advancing the capacities of sociotechnical systems is hopeful.

Being excluded from sociotechnical systems (or messing up sociotechnical systems) - there is a long way to fall down to a "state of nature."

Because sociotechnical factors are so very large - we are not, as a species, committed to zero sum games.

Too often, we act as if we are.

But we are very committed to orderly, complex technical and social systems - and we have to be careful, and conservative - for hope to be real.

We have a lot to lose. We live - as social beings, and as groups, in fragile circumstances.

Fredmoore's comment above is very important.

I think the very unstable conditions and powerful effects shown by Kline's growth curves reinforces reasons to answer Fredmoore's question carefully.

I'm trying to respond.

- -

We are team animals - and that's a big thing that Americans know pretty well - though we screw up a lot. By and large, we're good at forming and maintaining teams. And our education - so easy to criticise in other ways - build team forming and maintaining abilities.

rshow55 - 05:50pm Sep 2, 2003 EST (# 13471 of 13478)
Can we do a better job of finding truth? YES. Click "rshow55" for some things Lchic and I have done and worked for on this thread.

Almarst asks: "What would Berle say?"

Berle:

. 12916 http://forums.nytimes.com/webin/WebX?8@13.8b8LbdsKCLQ.0@.f28e622/14592

13363 http://forums.nytimes.com/webin/WebX?8@13.8b8LbdsKCLQ.0@.f28e622/15054

One thing that Berle would say is that people in power - who act with confidence when they are trusted - degrade that trust when they are wrong.

A problem is that, today, most leaders do not know how their own systems work - much less how the systems or other teams, led by other leaders, work.

That is dangerous.

. . . .

Eisenhower knew that very well - and he was very concerned. He thought it was important to learn how systems work - so that they could be better controlled.

Cheerleading, and dehumanizing people "not on the team" are patterns that have their uses. But they aren't good enough for everything that needs to be done.

Gisterme's criticism of me can be condensed very much - preserving most of the substance - as saying that I'm "not on the team."

I think he's wrong about that.

almarst2003 - 08:17pm Sep 2, 2003 EST (# 13472 of 13478)

The paradox is, those who are "not on the team" are dehumanized, killed and burned in a name of PULLING THEM ON THE "TEAM".

WHAT A WONDERFULL BAPTIST "TEAM"!

gisterme - 08:18pm Sep 2, 2003 EST (# 13473 of 13478)

rshow55 - 10:37am Aug 26, 2003 EST (# 13408 of ...)

http://forums.nytimes.com/webin/WebX?16@13.8b8LbdsKCLQ.0@.f28e622/15099

"...( For example, I try to be honest to God. )..."

Robert, if God knows everything, how can you possibly be dishonest to Him? Do you think you can hide something from God?

It would be much more meaningful if you said (and meant) that you try to be honest with yourself.

gisterme - 08:21pm Sep 2, 2003 EST (# 13474 of 13478)

"...I'm asking you a serious question, and I hope you'll provide me--and others who may be interested--with a serious, reasoned answer..."

I'd be interested in the answer to that one myself, Will. I've asked the same question before...of course, the answer was the famous Showalter, "I'll get to that later".

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