New York Times on the Web Forums Science

Missile Defense

Russian military leaders have expressed concern about US plans for a national missile defense system. Will defense technology be limited by possibilities for a strategic imbalance? Is this just SDI all over again?

rshowalt - 09:57pm Jul 29, 2001 EST (#7589 of 7605)

Interesting stuff. I'll read again, but a thing that strikes me is this. Patterns documented by almarst , again and again, and not by now subject to much dispute in essential ways, are acting against other ideals that Americans and their government stand for. In addition, we see technical decisions, on missile defense, grossly at variance with standards of careful mensuration and judgement that our government institutions know about and often practice in exemplary fashion.

Some things to be proud of, for sure. But other things to be less proud of.

MD7048 rshowalter 7/15/01 10:51am

MD5784-5787 rshowalter 6/22/01 1:05pm ... sets out Henry Kissinger on Trial: A Guide to the Controversy Surrounding the Diplomat from the Encyclopedia Britannica web site --February 2001

MD6341 rshowalter 6/30/01 3:07pm

MD5668-69 almarst-2001 6/21/01 9:14am

MD2689 rshowalter 4/28/01 7:25am ... MD2690 rshowalter 4/28/01 7:28am

MD2691 rshowalter 4/28/01 7:30am ... MD2692 rshowalter 4/28/01 7:31am

If we emphasized the ways American does well, and get rid of some old ugliness, and some ongoing fraud, the US, and the whole world, would be more beautiful, more prosperous, and safer.

rshowalt - 10:05pm Jul 29, 2001 EST (#7590 of 7605)

For example, the entire body of "militarization of space" work, on which Rumsfeld is basing so much, has no merit at all, and the responsible engineers involved with it have to know it. It is still hard to shoot down U-2's, and we've yet to get the Patriot missile working.

There are large bodies of fraudulent, misleading work, that can be shown, beyond reasonable doubt, to be grossly susbstandard, being backed by organizations that know better and are degrading themselves, for money, and because they've been so compromised, for so long, that the people involved see no way out.

This should be fixed.

If Americans don't insist on it, nation states that deal with us should.

rshowalt - 10:14pm Jul 29, 2001 EST (#7591 of 7605)

It is, however, somewhat worse than they know, becaue there is an error, in a computer algorithm that they use again and again, that can and does generate explosive errors, under conditions that matter, but which they are not checking.

The problem itself is interesting -- but the human processes that have kept the issue from being looked at are interesting, too. It is an example of "paradigm conflict" -- but not one that is entirely "no fault."

The discrepancy between claims and performance by the "military industrial complex" has been massive for a long time, and now the Bush administration, to keep the game going on, is threatening and disrupting the whole world with plans that are frauds (impure but, nontheless, fairly simple.) These frauds have a common structure. At the levels of words, and pretty pictures from commercial artists, they "look good" -- or can be made to look good. But the numbers are grossly, grossly, wrong, again and again.

If some basic facts could get checked, in public, for score, about what the "military industrial complex" actually has working , then the world would be close to many accomodations that would make things better.

rshowalt - 10:29pm Jul 29, 2001 EST (#7592 of 7605)

'Wilson's Ghost: Reducing the Risk of Conflict, Killing, and Catastrophe in the 21st Century' by ROBERT S. McNAMARA and JAMES G. BLIGHT

"As we look back from the 21st century on the events of the 20th, we cannot help being struck by the enormity of the human carnage . . . http://www.nytimes.com/2001/07/29/books/chapters/29-1stmcnam.html

'Wilson's Ghost': An Anti-Machiavellian Handbook by JAMES CHACE

"Robert S. McNamara and James G. Blight's new book embraces the Wilsonian notion that American foreign policy must be grounded on the bedrock of morality .... http://www.nytimes.com/2001/07/29/books/review/29CHASET.html

McNamara and Blight are clearly, inescapably right that morality must be involved in American foreign policy decisions.

Bill Casey thought so, too. He did things he knew were terrible, but he tried to keep score.
MD 7385 rshowalter 7/24/01 8:13pm . . . MD6057 rshowalter 6/26/01 7:22am

. . . .

Sometimes the issues involved are reasonably and inescapably personal , and depend on facing the truth, even when not all of it is pretty.

Vietnam Advance, and Pullback by JAMES BARRON http://www.nytimes.com/2001/07/26/nyregion/26BOLD.html

"DANIEL ELLSBERG, who made the Pentagon Papers public 30 years ago, wants a face-to- face chat with ROBERT S. McNAMARA, who was the secretary of defense during the Vietnam War. Yesterday, Mr. McNamara's publisher said Mr. McNamara had given a conditional green light."

(13 following messages)

New York Times on the Web Forums Science Missile Defense