New York Times on the Web Forums Science

Missile Defense

Russian military leaders have expressed concern about US plans for a national missile defense system. Will defense technology be limited by possibilities for a strategic imbalance? Is this just SDI all over again?

lunarchick - 08:17pm Jun 15, 2001 EST (#5241 of 5252)
lunarchick@www.com

Getting back to basics here, Showalter said and has repeated that the missiles are UNSTABLE, that they need to COME DOWN, that the COLD WAR will only actually CLOSE when they do.

Showalter has also noted that a lot of discourse flows before folks move along the continuum of understanding, hence the need to mull over and over comes not from him, rather from his noting a necessity ... for minds to assimalte and accommodate.

Discourse moves on with minds.

There are a lot of people who see Missiles as a dangerous box of crackers liable to blow, and throughout the world people (some noted on this thread) are wanting the world to stabalise weapons and move on. Indeed if a stray missile can start off a 'flow-on' effect of missile firing - it is a dangerous matter that has to be taken much more seriously by world politicians.

I've made the point that human procreation is also about future generations have an improved lifestyle with education, comfort, and purpose - often expressed through employment.

Showing that the people everywhere have commonalities of purpose. They want peace, prosperity and a future for the younger generations ... who in turn look for a 'less polluted world'.

gisterme - 08:18pm Jun 15, 2001 EST (#5242 of 5252)

lunarchick wrote: "...Regarding discourse and volume of words, one might argue that the reason why Europe is happier with the 72 agreement rather than the proposed sheild is because looking at the discourse on 'Shield' they have yet to discover conceptualisations that are both believeable and that they can feel comfortable with..."

From what I've been reading, countries that DON'T feel the way you've described are those that were formemly occupied by the Soviets. Plus Britain and Spain. Most others have expressed "reservations" rather than outright rejection including the Russians. The Russians are willing at least to talk. To me that is a real breakthrough.

Could the US build a BMD unilaterally? Of course it could; but if the purpose of a BMD is to protect against thugs, Europe is within range of more of them than the US. If the BMD is to be a tool for strategic nuclear disarmament it's better for everybody if everybody gets some. That's why I think that at the end of the day if a BMD is actually built it will be with strong international cooperation and contribution. None of the holders of strategic nuclear weapons are enemies.

Actually, international cooperation on the ISS might be a model for technical cooperation to build a joint BMD. There have been and are a lot of lessons being learned there by everybody involved. Look at the whole Tito-the-space-tourist event. :-) Listening to NASA, you'd have thought the sky was falling. And the Russian space agency wasn't very diplomatic either. Yet Tito had a good time and didn't break anyting. I think the real truth is that NASA just doesn't like the feeling of being side-by-side with anybody else in the pecking order. Neither did the Russians. But now, everybody seems to have gotten over it. Life goes on. All parties have learned some lessons about getting along and about the right ways to do things WRT each other. To me that's encouraging.

gisterme - 08:18pm Jun 15, 2001 EST (#5243 of 5252)

Out for today.

lunarchick - 08:27pm Jun 15, 2001 EST (#5244 of 5252)
lunarchick@www.com

Don't confuse politeness with understanding. The take on the matter is that the Shield is not understood - not even by scientist's formal bodies. The news comment i've heard is that there is much skepticism, that the Shield is a joke, that no one wants to offend the US with respect to TRADE. Look at the fact that the US science body couldn't really comprehend it ... less so distant politicans!

lunarchick - 08:31pm Jun 15, 2001 EST (#5245 of 5252)
lunarchick@www.com

Buckshot in bottoms has taken the EU news! The worst politically inspired riot in Swedens' history. http://news.bbc.co.uk/ BwshPutin

rshowalter - 09:26pm Jun 15, 2001 EST (#5246 of 5252)
Robert Showalter showalte@macc.wisc.edu

Interesting story, about interesting moral conflicts, and human failings, in an imperfect world.
Accused Spy Informed Wife and Priest of Espionage Activities By JAMES RISEN and DAVID JOHNSTON http://www.nytimes.com/2001/06/15/national/15CND-HANSSEN.html?pagewanted=all

rshowalter - 09:28pm Jun 15, 2001 EST (#5247 of 5252)
Robert Showalter showalte@macc.wisc.edu

MD5200 rshowalter 6/15/01 1:54pm ..... reads in part

MD775 . . . presents a sermon that I feel the staffs of the leaders of two great nations, meeting together, might reasonably listen to today.

. . .

People of more secular views might want to skip ahead to 9:27 in the sermon . Thereafter, it is a tribute to a Russian colonel, who kept nuclear war from destroying us all, during the Reagan administration.

WHEN THE FOUNDATIONS ARE SHAKING ..... by James Slatton . . . . available in RealMedia, Quicktime, and Windows Media7 formats http://www.wisc.edu/rshowalt/sermon.html

(5 following messages)

New York Times on the Web Forums Science Missile Defense